My Beaut Aussie Cent

[Fabrice Le Roux]

Stephen,
Excellent info. Is that a synopsis of WO 194/526?
Clearly the Dunstan and Monroe books are wrong about this. Did you examine any other papers there?
Cheers, Fabrice

[Stephen White]

Yes Fabrice, as stated. I've got some interesting stuff on the iPhone on Cent and Comet, which I'll download over the weekend. I trawled through one particularly fat file concerning upgunning to 105mm in the hope I could find the barrel dimensons compared wth the 20 pdr. No luck but it was fascinating reading. The upgunning was a direct response to the emergence of the Russian T55. The Cent 105mm was always regarded as an interim solution because Chieftain (or "Medium Tank Type 2") was under development at the time. But as we now know, Chieftain was late and the 105mm Cents went on to sell worldwide and be a great success. It did confirm that the breech assembly was retained and that the raw materials for the last batch of 20 pdr barrels were diverted at source to make the new 105mm barrels. There is one tantalising implication that some test 105mm barrels had been made by converting 20 pdrs but no direct reference that I could find. So I'm no wiser on the changes needed for the Armortek barrel. Looks like a long ladder at the Tank Museum........

More later.

Stephen

[Stephen White]

When you think you've got something sorted, a piece of evidence turns up to make you think again. So it is with the idler saga. I thought it was fairly straitforward: the first Cents had a "long spoke" idler which cracked. It was replaced with a "short spoke" idler and eventually with a "dished idler", something like this:



So to confirm, why not have a look at the first production batch of Mk 1 Cents?



Well this one is P1, the first prototype and it has a dished idler but with smaller holes than the later one and a splined hub - so it's a fourth type. Perhaps it was the idler from the Comet? It turns up again later in the Mk 3 handbook. Then there are these:



And:



So from this evidence, the "short spoke" idler looks to pre-date the "long spoke" variety. I then looked in the illustrated parts list, which seems to confirm it:



On the left is the "short spoke" which is referred to in 1947 as the Split Idler (ie two piece). On the right is its later replacement, the "one piece" or "long spoke" idler, which is definately the sort which cracked in Vietnam. So what caused the split idler to be replaced? I found some reports in the National Archives into the tendancy of Cent to shed its tracks. Whilst it doesn't mention idlers, it is noticeable that the one piece idler is assymetric and much wider. Maybe it was introduced to help with the track throwing but had in turn to be replaced with the dish type when it was found to be cracking. So the order of batting is probably this:



ie split idler, one piece idler, dished idler. This seems to be born out in part in the User handbooks:



Top right is a drawing from the Handbook for the Mk 3,5,6. The drawing depicts an early Mk 3 and it has the dished idler with splined hub seen earlier on the first production batch. Contrast that with bottom left which is representative of the later marks, sporting the one piece idler.

I'm still not convinced this is definitive but the research has been interesting, if you like that sort of thing..... Roll on the boxes arriving.

Regards

Stephen

[Stephen White]

Some details from the report into up-armouring the Centurion Glacis. Photos by permission of the National Archives.



And here, the results of some of the proof firing trials at Shoeburyness:





Regards

Stephen

[phil fitzpatrick]

Hi Stephen
I have been fo;;owing your Centurion research from the begining,it is
facinating to read what you discover.
A wanderfull help for all the Cent builders.
I have to report that while arranging my Tiger 1 option delivery,that Gill
told me that she was up to her knees in Centurian box's
Cheers
Phil

[Stephen White]

It's not every day a UPS van backs into your hedge..........



It's that great moment, the email from Gill arranging the delivery, the waiting in for the van, the raised eyebrows from the van driver when you reveal what's in the boxes and then out with the Stanley knife, a shower of angel poo and it's here:





Cent 001, "my beaut Aussie Cent" has arrived. It's a monster. The turret casting is a real work of art and seriously heavy:





The hull sides and track guards dwarf the Comet:





Some of the changes Mark made after the prototype, including repositioning the rear track guide roller on the final drive, re-positioning the cone bolts on the cupola ring and one very welcome new move - the bins are now made from really accurately cut sheet metal, folded and tack welded. This is a far better solution than machining from a billet of aluminium and it's great that Mark has made this great leap forward;





All in all, a another fantastic Armortek kit, ready to go. Can't wait.

Regards

Stephen

[phil fitzpatrick]

Wow Stephen
You even photographed the man in brown's van
You can feel the excitement on receiving another great new Armortek Kit.
Look forward to the build and all the others.
Regards
Phil

[Dennis Jones]

Hi Stephen,

I reckon the decision has been made then, it looks as though the Comet is on the back burner !!!!!

Dennis.

[Fabrice Le Roux]

Stephen,

Many thanks for posting your PRO finds. I will keep looking for a Dished Idler drawing as that seems to be the only missing part of the puzzle. Looks like the shaft was not modified at least. Do you see a difference in diameter between the Split and Spoke type or between the Spoke and Dish types?

Gill will be very impressed that you bulled up your boots for the new arrival .

Looking forward to your build and insightful commentary.
Cheers Fabrice

[Stephen White]

Well, here goes with Buku Boom Boom, ARN 169007, callsign 24A of 4 Troop, B Squadron, 1st Armoured Regiment, Royal Australian Armoured Corps at the Battle of Binh Ba, Vietnam, 6 June 1969. This build is dedicated to the members of the 1st Armoured Regiment Association who were there and who've helped with research so far.

Denis - well spotted!

The keel is laid:





Mark does all the hard work producing a great engineering model, which goes together so easily. But there is always just enough scope for extra detailing and it's the research and thinking about how to realise new details which I enjoy and which extends the build. As Kent says, it's all in the details.

So here are some of the first things which I'd like to do on the Cent to make a Mark 5/1 Australian:



Fabrice - thanks. I've got no dimensions for the outside diameter of the three types of idler but an operator in Australia who has got a mix of one and two piece idlers says his tank pulls to one side on hard surfaces which suggests they may be slightly different. I've got no info yet on the dished idler. I'd like to know more about why three types were produced and in what order. I do know that the one piece were prone to failure in Vietnam and had to have strengthening strips applied locally.

Regards

Stephen

[sean kerambrun]

Hi guys,

I live in Melbourne, Australia there are a number of centurions near by (ish)and to help with my build will be visiting them every so often. If you need pics or dimensions I will see if I can help. The nearest australian tank is at the local RSL its a Leo1A4 and only 5 mins away.. I really wish it was a Centurion..

There are 2 centurion at Caribbean market (about 20 mins away)

Puckapunyal tank museum is about 2.5 hours away and am planning a trip in early December

Tank ride have a Centurion too
http://www.adrenalin.com.au/tank-ride-m ... port/13619

A centurion book too

http://www.mheaust.com.au/MHE/Books/Milbrief3.htm


Anyway if I can help let me know

Cheers

Sean

[Stephen White]

Sean, that's a kind offer. Looking forward to seeing your build (and the others).

Started on the hull undersurface. On this build, I'm intending to do a lot of the detailing of each sub-assembly on the bench to see if it makes working easier.

First the inspection plates and drains on the hull bottom. They were:

- 2 large plates for clutch and oil pump access and the coolant drain.
- 5 small plates for fuel and oil drains and the drain for the driver's compartment.

The plates were attached by bolts from the outside and sat within an armoured flange to protect them. It became the habit for drivers to make life easier for themselves by replacing the drain from the inside. In Vietnam, this practice was highlighted when a mine detonated under the cab and the plug was detached with fatal results.

Locating, machining and mounting the plates and plugs:









Milliput weld seams added, then all the surfaces were given a light sanding and cleaned with acetone and etch primed. Then a high build primer was applied to give a base for texturing. The Cent armour had a rough surface with a lot of pitting, both on the rolled plates and cast turret, so texturing adds a lot of character:





Finally a coat of red primer to provide a key for the base colour:



Regards

Stephen

[Stephen White]

Beginning dry assembly of the basic hull structure. It all went together very easily and quickly with little fitting needed. The hull is very close to the real thing but as ever, there is scope for detailing, most of which is about re-creating the joins and welds of the real thing:





There are a number of possibilities such as adjusting forward the rear plates to create the overlap of the side plates, raising the top deck, creating a chamfer on the rear hull sides, interlocking the toe plate and the hull bottom. The last one was quick to do and required a small rebate to be milled in the toe plate:







Regards

Stephen

[neil pudney]

hi stephen, you have some great references there, the drawings you are using for the placement of these parts, is it something that is available as i would like to add extra details like these myself. Any help would be appreciated,thanks

[Stephen White]

Neil - delighted to help. The illustrations come from the Cent AFV Illustrated Parts List. To keep everything in one place, I've put details about how you can get hold of some of them on my Centurion References thread here:

http://www.armortek.co.uk/Forum3b/viewt ... 593#p36593

Hope that helps and good luck.

Stephen