Late Tiger Turret Stowage Bins

[Stu Diener]

Hello everyone,
I'm a recent proud owner of a new Armortek Late Tiger 1 kit (grabbed the second last kit of the 2017 production run I believe). I have been lurking taking note of the extremely high level of attention to detail that many of you are pursuing, and yep I am in awe - fantastic work guys (and gals?).

I decided I would baptise myself in the Armortek forum with my first post, and that is regarding the Turret Stowage bins. I have roughly assembled that which cam with my kit and can immediately see that I will need a fair amount of attention to detail to make it more realistic. I have noted that many of you are including rivets, but is that something that they only did with early Tigers? Or were they pretty much the same build for all versions? I am yet to find any decent pics on the web for late Tigers.

Secondly, I was thinking that I might have a crack at making my own version from some brass sheet (to get edges sharper - ironic given that I then want to bash it up and make it look battle worn). Any feedback as to that approach and what things I can consider are greatly appreciated.

Cheers,
Stu.

[mark lawson]

Morning Stu, as we all know the internet is not the best place to find pictures unless you use the Tiger Im Focus forum, probably the best books are Tigers in Combat Volumes 1 - 3 these books are packed with information and pictures along with brief combat history on all Tiger abseiling.

Rommelkist on all late Tiger was the same sheet riveted construction.5

[Vince Cutajar]

Hi Stu and welcome to the forum.

Are you going to do a build log showing your progress? It's amazing what one can learn from other people's photo's and comments. I, for one, have learned new techiniques from studying other build logs (not just Tiger 1 builds). One thing I learned in the begining of my build (still going on) is to divide various parts into sub-assemblies. When I opened up my boxes when they arrived I had a panic attack when I saw all those parts. The turret bin can be considered as a sub-assembly and so you only have to deal with the parts of the turret bin. Hope I am making sense.

Regarding photos, as Mark suggested, I have also invested in some Tiger 1 books but still that is not enough. Looking on the internet sometimes helps with images (https://www.bing.com/images/search?q=ti ... ORM=HDRSC2). If that does not help than I usually ask here and there is always somebody who can provide images or information about a particular part.

If you intend to fabricate your own turret bin have a look here: http://tiger1.info/EN/Standard-turret-bin.html

Vince

[Stu Diener]

Vince & Mark - Thank you for the information, I will follow up on those leads.

I will probably start a build thread, but I have more research to do yet - I have in mind that I would like to base mine on 3rd SS Division "Totenkopf", but am still trying to nail down a camouflage pattern that they might have employed and confirmation of Turret numbering (I think I saw a turret with 912 on the side - have to go back and see where I saw that again). In my hunt for information, I had stumbled across a youtube video with a title "Soldaten Erzahlen" That has a Manfred Diener talking of his involvement with 3rd SS. Same family name, but I have no idea as to how far back we are related (if at all - probably not). Anyway - its all in German so I can only pick out bits and pieces. I gathered enough to believe that Manfred was crew on Panthers though not Tigers.

Cheers,

Stu Diener

[Stephen White]

Stu, welcome. Hope you really enjoy your build, especially the research and making custom parts.

I built new bins for both my Pz III and Centurion. It's very satisfying but there are some tricks of the trade. There are a couple of Knowledge Base Topics on soldering - I haven't written them up, so they're only extracts from build logs but are a good starting point.

http://www.armortek.co.uk/Forum3b/viewt ... 8ff8e5e36e

http://www.armortek.co.uk/Forum3b/viewt ... 8ff8e5e36e

I'll post the links to the relevant pages of my Pz III and Cent logs below. A few things I've learnt along the way:

- start with a card maquette. That will give you the patterns and the fit.

- use tinplate or brass. Good sizes are .025" (.635mm) for the base and .010" (.25mm) for the rest.

- bending, cutting/shearing, rolling sheet. You can use a vice for bending and aviation shears for cutting but better still, invest in a "formit", which combines all three, such as this one:

https://www.warco.co.uk/sheet-metal-fab ... chine.html

- work holding. This is key and will govern whether the job is easy or hugely frustrating. One good system is to use a piece of sheet steel as a base and rare earth magnets to hold and support the work. I've shown some methods on the links below.

- soldering. This is likewise the source of head banging frustration or smooth operation. Cleaning joints is vital. I'd use a solvent cleaner first and then a fibreglass cleaning pen. For the soldering, your biggest challenge is managing the heat. I use silver solder, which requires about 450deg C. That can be a challenge on a long seam. A butane soldering torch is a cheap option - such as the Dremel:

https://www.dremel.com/en_US/products/- ... tane-torch

You might also need direct flame:

https://www.proxxon.com/en/micromot/28146.php

Always beware of heat build-up: I had the Rommelkiste on my Pz III nearly disintegrate as I was trying to add the last bits, the catches, because I'd been a bit too enthusiastic with the final seams. It's a good idea to invest in some small G-clamps which you can attach either side of the seam to act as heat sinks.

The ultimate tool for soldering up bins is a resistance soldering machine. It really does give you the perfect option but isn't cheap. I don't know where you're based but in the US, the company American Beauty leads and in Europe, the best option is a seller called London Road models:

https://americanbeautytools.com/Resista ... eIQAvD_BwE

https://traders.scalefour.org/LondonRoa ... and-tools/

My Pz III Rommelkiste:

http://www.armortek.co.uk/Forum3b/viewt ... &start=480

Centurion bins. Various places in the build but start here (track guard bins):

http://www.armortek.co.uk/Forum3b/viewt ... &start=570

and here (turret bins):

http://www.armortek.co.uk/Forum3b/viewt ... &start=840

Good luck, hope you enjoy it and do share your progress, we all learn that way.

Stephen

[mark lawson]

If you are wanting information on Totenkopf Tiger then this book https://www.panzerwrecks.com/product/totenkopf-tigers is what you are looking for it includes colour plates

[Stu Diener]

Stephen - WOW! Thankyou very much kind sir. Excellent information - and you even pre-empted my question on sheet thickness to use.

Stu, welcome. Hope you really enjoy your build, especially the research and making custom parts.

I built new bins for both my Pz III and Centurion. It's very satisfying but there are some tricks of the trade. There are a couple of Knowledge Base Topics on soldering - I haven't written them up, so they're only extracts from build logs but are a good starting point.

http://www.armortek.co.uk/Forum3b/viewt ... 8ff8e5e36e

http://www.armortek.co.uk/Forum3b/viewt ... 8ff8e5e36e

I'll post the links to the relevant pages of my Pz III and Cent logs below. A few things I've learnt along the way:

- start with a card maquette. That will give you the patterns and the fit.

- use tinplate or brass. Good sizes are .025" (.635mm) for the base and .010" (.25mm) for the rest.

- bending, cutting/shearing, rolling sheet. You can use a vice for bending and aviation shears for cutting but better still, invest in a "formit", which combines all three, such as this one:

https://www.warco.co.uk/sheet-metal-fab ... chine.html

- work holding. This is key and will govern whether the job is easy or hugely frustrating. One good system is to use a piece of sheet steel as a base and rare earth magnets to hold and support the work. I've shown some methods on the links below.

- soldering. This is likewise the source of head banging frustration or smooth operation. Cleaning joints is vital. I'd use a solvent cleaner first and then a fibreglass cleaning pen. For the soldering, your biggest challenge is managing the heat. I use silver solder, which requires about 450deg C. That can be a challenge on a long seam. A butane soldering torch is a cheap option - such as the Dremel:

https://www.dremel.com/en_US/products/- ... tane-torch

You might also need direct flame:

https://www.proxxon.com/en/micromot/28146.php

Always beware of heat build-up: I had the Rommelkiste on my Pz III nearly disintegrate as I was trying to add the last bits, the catches, because I'd been a bit too enthusiastic with the final seams. It's a good idea to invest in some small G-clamps which you can attach either side of the seam to act as heat sinks.

The ultimate tool for soldering up bins is a resistance soldering machine. It really does give you the perfect option but isn't cheap. I don't know where you're based but in the US, the company American Beauty leads and in Europe, the best option is a seller called London Road models:

https://americanbeautytools.com/Resista ... eIQAvD_BwE

https://traders.scalefour.org/LondonRoa ... and-tools/

My Pz III Rommelkiste:

http://www.armortek.co.uk/Forum3b/viewt ... &start=480

Centurion bins. Various places in the build but start here (track guard bins):

http://www.armortek.co.uk/Forum3b/viewt ... &start=570

and here (turret bins):

http://www.armortek.co.uk/Forum3b/viewt ... &start=840

Good luck, hope you enjoy it and do share your progress, we all learn that way.

Stephen

[Stu Diener]

Many thanks Mark :thumbs up:

If you are wanting information on Totenkopf Tiger then this book https://www.panzerwrecks.com/product/totenkopf-tigers is what you are looking for it includes colour plates