Dunkelgelb source

[Ray Massa]

Being an Armortek Panther G (2022) builder in the states like, I was wondering what paint builders are using for the Dunkelgelb color. I have found it hard to get that color in the states except for Tamiya TS-3 which is only in small spray cans and expensive for the size. I prefer using spray cans and not a sprayer and compressor setup.
I am currently just starting a Panther G and it seems that is the only acceptable base color. I would like other options such as a gray, but have not been able to find any references for a Panther in a basic gray color.

Thanks.

-Ray

[Malcolm.Plumb]

I'm using the Army Paint Industrial Dunkel Gelb.
Works well.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/153695413848 ... R-617KD7Yg

https://foscoindustries.com/army-paint/

Not sure if its available in the US though.

[Ray Massa]

I'm using the Army Paint Industrial Dunkel Gelb.
Works well.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/153695413848 ... R-617KD7Yg

https://foscoindustries.com/army-paint/

Not sure if its available in the US though.

I have seen that many use these paints, but they are not available in the U.S. May have to have a custom automotive paint mix done (and put in spray cans) or just go with a whole lot of Tamiya spray cans.

-Thanks.

[Malcolm.Plumb]

Hi Ray

Its a shame they are not available at all

You are going to need to buy such a lot of Tamiya cans if you go down that route.

[Adrian Harris]

Regarding your idea of a grey Panther, there's an interesting page here about how few grey Tigers there might have been:

https://tiger1.info/EN/Grey-Tigers.html

Given that the Tiger pre-dated the Panther in service by nearly a year, it's almost impossible that any would have been grey.

Having said that, there's apparently a passage in "Germany's Panther Tank" (page 93) which says: "On October 31, 1944, MNH received instructions to paint Panthers with sparingly painted patterns of Rotbraun RAL 8017, Olivegruen RAL 6003, and Dunkelgelb RAL 7028 applied to the red oxide primer. "If Dunkelgelb wasn't available, Dunkelgrau RAL 7021 could be used in an extreme emergency, otherwise Dunkelgrau was to be conserved".

So you could paint it Red Oxide, with Rotbraun, Olivegruen and Dunkelgrau camo - just to be a bit different

Adrian

[Ray Massa]

Regarding your idea of a grey Panther, there's an interesting page here about how few grey Tigers there might have been:

https://tiger1.info/EN/Grey-Tigers.html

Given that the Tiger pre-dated the Panther in service by nearly a year, it's almost impossible that any would have been grey.

Having said that, there's apparently a passage in "Germany's Panther Tank" (page 93) which says: "On October 31, 1944, MNH received instructions to paint Panthers with sparingly painted patterns of Rotbraun RAL 8017, Olivegruen RAL 6003, and Dunkelgelb RAL 7028 applied to the red oxide primer. "If Dunkelgelb wasn't available, Dunkelgrau RAL 7021 could be used in an extreme emergency, otherwise Dunkelgrau was to be conserved".

So you could paint it Red Oxide, with Rotbraun, Olivegruen and Dunkelgrau camo - just to be a bit different

Adrian

Thanks Adrian. I have painted a lot of the steel pieces in red oxide so far, and a lot of the aluminum pieces in UPOL etch primer as I used on my M26, but have time to decide the final color. I did not think a Panther was ever gray since I never could find a photo of one. May have to just get some custom automotive paint put in spray cans.

-Ray

[Ray Massa]

Update on finding Dunkelgelb in the states;

I found a source for a spray paint called "Vallejo AFV Color Panzer Yellow Spray "in a 400ml can (13 oz) for $12 which is reasonable compared to Tamiya so I will probably just use that. It is referenced as Dunkelgelb.

-Ray

[Jerry Carducci]

Not that's a great help to anyone but A volunteer colleague makes my interpretation of the DunkelGelb paint for me using (white) aviation paint as a base. (This fellow was an aviation coatings chemist by profession and has mixed all the paint we use for our aircraft restorations). It can be used with or without a hardener (also useful for my alcohol based powered models that are hard on paint). When used with a hardener it is very hard when cured but the time between coats is very critical.

I used this paint on my SdKfz 7, 88 and now my King Tiger. For these models I do not use the hardener. I do use either a DeVilbiss touch up gun
running around 50 psi or a Paasche airbrush for smaller areas or parts at 45 psi. Thinned with Xylene. I use an organics respirator and shoot my parts
outside.

When using hardener it's imperative that spray equipment is clean thoroughly, immediately.

Jerry

[Will Roberts]

Hello Ray et al,

I wouldn't use Dunkelgelb as a overall "base" colour on a Panther G after October 1944. The Germans were running out of paint at this time and painted the 3 colour camouflage directly over the Red Oxide in approximately 1/3 per colour so no overall painting of Dunkelgelb. In fact later in the war green and brown were used in greater proportion as you can see on the 1/35th scale painting guides. Worn out green and brown would reveal primer, not Dunkelgelb. Also RAL 7028 is not the only Dunkelgelb that was used so some variation is useful.

Kind regards,

Will.

[Chris.Marshall]

Or you could channel a bit of the Henri Mancini and paint it PINK ! - I'm doing a Tiger 1, but if I was doing a Panther I would be Soooooo tempted.... Not remotely prototypical ....... Unless....... the SAS captured one and repainted it .... That was in the 1960's though....

WIKIPEDIA - Landrover:- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Land ... r_1968.jpg

" A well-known version was the LRDPV (Long-Range Desert Patrol Vehicle), commonly called the 'Pink Panther', on account of their distinctive light pink sand camouflage. These 109-inch (2.77 m) series IIs were converted by Marshall's of Cambridge by being stripped of doors and windscreens and fitted with grenade launchers, a machine gun mounting ring and long-range fuel tanks and water tanks. They were used by the SAS for desert patrol and special operations."

My excuse is that It's been a long week...... OK... I'll go away now.....

Chris.

[Ray Massa]

Or you could channel a bit of the Henri Mancini and paint it PINK ! - I'm doing a Tiger 1, but if I was doing a Panther I would be Soooooo tempted.... Not remotely prototypical ....... Unless....... the SAS captured one and repainted it .... That was in the 1960's though....

Chris,

Ha, ha! I am not that brave to paint it pink. Plus pink will clash with my olive drab M26 when they run together!

-Ray

[Chris.Marshall]

Yeh,.... Pink was Soooo last season.

Yes been a Looong week, just needed a bit of daftness to relieve things.

But seriously, a pitty you can't get the Mil paint in the US, and the Tamiya is expensive. For my money I'd get one of the local car paint folk to mix the colour in a matt base. I did this for my locomotive project, The local spray paint co. mixed up RAL colours for me, worked great and colour match very good. The other thing is, that even if the shade is a fraction out, it would never be noticed except in a very straight comparison.

Hope you find a good source.

All the best and have a good weekend,

C.

[Ray Massa]

Chris,

I’ll leave a post here when I get the paint that I found and let you and others know how it looks compared to Tamiya TS-3 spray.

I know at least a couple people who are using flat exterior house paint and apparently that works very well.

-Ray

[Chris.Marshall]

OK.....

Local friend here in the UK has used 'house paint' in a semi matt on the Pershing and Panther. He brush painted and the results are certainly better than one would naturally expect.

Chris.

[Ray Massa]

So attached is a picture of Tamiya TS-3 Dark Yellow and Vallejo Dunkelgelb Panzer Yellow which I just received that I thought would be close to the TS-3 based on the color chip on the web. Not even close. The Vallejo is very green as you can see. These were taken under daylight LED lights. The Tamiya color chips on the web are fairly close however. The center strip is pure white and I added in the aluminum piece that is painted UPOL gray etch primer as a reference.

So I am still not sure what dark yellow I will go with, but most likely not the Vallejo. There are other shades of the Vallejo brand that look good, but I can't trust the color chips on the web.