Steel Panther Tracks - SOLD

[Phil Markham]

I have decided to sell my set of steel Panther tracks to free up funds for other things. These are the one's made by Vincent Hung Shu Yue. I have never had them fitted to my Panther, they have been boxed up since I bought them. They have great detail including casting numbers. The picture is one that I have borrowed from Vinces thread for illustration purposes (saves me unpacking from the box).
I may consider selling in small numbers (Packs of 12) for tank mounted detail parts if there was enough interest.
Please PM for price.

Phil

[Robert Tanzer]

Pn send.
Robert

[Didier Molard]

Hello Phil,
PM sent too.
Didier

[David M Wilks]

PM sent ,cheers .

[Gerhard Michel]

Hello guys,

please keep in mind that these links do not fit the standard AT sprockets. For tank mounted details, e.g. spare parts they are superb.

[Jerry Carducci]

Hello guys,

please keep in mind that these links do not fit the standard AT sprockets. For tank mounted details, e.g. spare parts they are superb.

Being ever eager to learn Gerhard, what aspect of these tracks makes them incompatible with standard AT sprockets? The pitch of the track or the spacing (laterally) between the sprocket engagement holes? Can they be used with modifications to the original sprockets or with the addition
of suitable tooth rings? Both?

Jerry

[Phil Markham]

Hi All,

I think Gerhards statement that these do not fit AT sprockets is slightly misleading. Some have simply found that a spacer is required to create 1-2mm of extra clearance between the inner and outer sprockets. I know that Steve Norris and Vincent used these spacers so perhaps they may choose to comment. Others like Bodo Langbehn seemed to have no issues.

As there are only 23 sets of these out there feedback is limited. It is true to say that some have found that these tracks do not like rough terrain due to the grip provided by the chevrons and hard ground seems to be the recommended running surface. Regardless they are highly detailed robust track links so if your running on hard ground or building a static kit they certainly add realism.

Here is Gerhard's own thread on his personal experiences - viewtopic.php?f=14&t=6245&start=45

Also below is a picture I've borrowed from Steve showing the spacers he made. I just happen to have a number of the superb 1/6 scale brass Panther track links from das Giesswerk, as you can see from the pictures they are practically identical, so much so that they link together with one of Vincent's track pins perfectly which I think is a testament to the accuracy of the link that Vincent produced. Anyway, do your own research as they say

Steve Norris.jpeg (156.7 KiB) Viewed 1500 times

[Gerhard Michel]

Hi Phil,

okay, I should better have said that the links do not fit the sprockets without spacers. Not everyone is able to build such spacers for himself, I think.

The bigger problem is however that these links do not like grippy grounds. A comrade therefore removed nearly all the chevron height, but without a real success. These links are destinated for hard grounds like cobblestones, asphalt and so on, but not for grass or sand. Therefore I removed this track and replaced it by the original one, and I don't know anyone in Germany who uses this tracks for driving.

In my opinion one reason for this behaviour is the drive train of the Panther with its kind of road wheels. Tiger, King Tiger and Hunting Tiger use another shape which not allows the track to leave the guiding of the road wheels. Both of my King Tigers and the Hunting Tiger use Olafs steel track links without any kind of problems, also on grippy grounds.

[Christoffer Ahlfors]

Very interesting to see Vincent's links together with Giesswerk's - thank you Phil!

Here are a number of possible reasons compiled from rumours out there - some definitely true, some unknown:

• 1 The tracking width is different and needs to be accounted for - not just on the sprocket, but on all wheels. The panther only guides the track with the middle roadwheels (the inner- and outermost do not).
  2 The links can shift axially about 1mm per link - plenty of washers are required to make sure the track remains straight.
  3 The track pins may be too thin, resulting in track that can curve significantly - as devastating as #2.
  4 The steel is allegedly inferior.
  5 The guide horns are prototypically correct and thus maybe too delicate and break.
  
  In combination with the aggressive teeth, these issues compound. Giesswerk's equally aggressive teeth work well with scratch built panthers, so the teeth can't be the only reason, but they are certainly quite demanding.
  
  There are reports that the guide horns bend and break. Something wrong with the steel is a possibility, but I think it could also be running gear issues like the above. If the track is allowed to bend or shift axially, the road wheels will hammer on the horns at an angle, instead of just easily slipping into the correct position. Just a thought.

[Gerhard Michel]

Unfortunately Giesswerk's products are no longer available, because the owner has died.

Here a damaged track link of Vincent's delivery. The teeth were bent extremely by throwing the tread and are here already corrected again:

[Phil Markham]

Can I please ask that forum members refrain from using my for sale posting as a discussion topic and place to express their opinions, some of which are by their own admission based on rumour and speculation. I respect and value everyone's opinion but this is the for sale section guys.
I felt it was the right thing to do by responding to Gerhard's initial statement in the interests of accuracy and full disclosure but that should have been an end to it, at least on my for sale advert.

I will frankly be amazed if my buyer still wants to purchase the links after the comments posted here. I would rather these sold as a complete set as they seem to run absolutely fine on hard ground with the 2mm spacer modification. With the new Panther G and its road wheel and sprocket upgrade it would be interesting to see a set being used on the new Panther. Perhaps there will now be an opportunity for someone to produce bolt on steel sprocket rings.

As I have already said, these would be beautiful detail parts for the hull but it would seem a shame to break the set up like that. At the end of the day it makes no real difference to me if these sell as a set or in part but please respect the fact that this is the for sale section. Perhaps any further discussion on this could be directed to the place it started - Gerhards Jagdpanther build.

Thank you

[Gary Phillipson]

Hi Phil.how much are you asking for the set.

[Christoffer Ahlfors]

Apologies.

[Phil Markham]

Apologies.

No problem

[Phil Markham]

NOW SOLD.