Armortek

Hi All!

Greetings from across the pond (Pennsylvania). I'm a new customer and ordered the JadgTiger to build with my dad. We haven't built a kit like this before so we're both trying to absorb as much information as possible.

Learning about the JadgTiger has been a bit of a challenge due to somewhat limited information. I have ordered and read the following books. If anyone has advice on any other books that would provide useful images and information it would be appreciated:

* Jagdtiger: The Most Powerful Armoured Fighting Vehicle of World War II: OPERATIONAL HISTORY - https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/0764307517/
* Jagdtiger: The Most Powerful Armoured Fighting Vehicle of World War II: TECHNICAL HISTORY - https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/0764307509/
* The Combat History of German Heavy Anti-Tank Unit 653 in World War II - https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/0811732428/
* The Complete Guide to German Armored Vehicles: Panzers, Jagdpanzers, Assault Guns, Antiaircraft, Self-Propelled Artillery, Armored Wheeled and Semi-Tracked Vehicles, and More - https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/1510716572/
* German Tanks of World War II: 1939-1945 (Technical Guides) - https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/1782747265/

The first two being dedicated to the JadgTiger have the bulk of the information but the combat history of Unit 653 is pretty darn fascinating and provides unique insight into the operational and combat issues that these behemoths had. The Germans blew up a LOT of JadgTigers due to mechanical breakdowns that couldn't be addressed.

We've spent HOURS watching youtube videos from oddball795mm the guy that owns https://www.eastcoastarmory.com and have found them exceedingly informative. The detail and knowledge level is off the charts. If there are other youtubers I should be watching to gain information on building again I would appreciate being pointed in the right direction.

I still haven't figured out the best strategy to use in painting the model yet. It seems like John from East Coast Armory uses an incremental approach to painting, particularly when it comes to the road wheels and suspension. Also trying to understand the best options for paint in the correct dunkelgelb, rotbraun, and other colors I would like to use for a 3 color camo scheme.

I've also watched a lot of information about zimmerit. Applying it, different tools and techniques, etc. But I haven't seen a lot of information about the correct size (width, ridge height, etc) for zimmerit at 1:6 scale. As before any tips, hints, etc would be appreciated.

And finally any guidance on potential sources for items that might be considered as accessories for the JadgTiger would be appreciated. We are planning at this point to mount an MG-42 on the back deck on a pedestal so I acquired a Dragon 1:6 scale model to use for that purpose. Obviously East Coast Armory has add-ons for the late Tiger at least some of which I assume will apply to the JadgTiger, and it appears that Armortek itself includes items from Armorpax - https://www.armorpax.net but we will be interested in adding inside hatch details to the kit.

OK That was waaaay more than I intended to type but thank you for your time and attention and any help you can provide!

tldr; Bought a JadgTiger kit to build with my old man, have lots of questions!

It's thought only the Jagdtiger with Porsche suspension had zimmerit I have never seen anything to suggest otherwise. Schwere Panzerjager Abteilung 653 was the only Schwere Abteilung to be fully equipped with Jagdtiger, many were used individually or only at zug level, around 80 were built and almost half went to Panzerjager Abteilung 653.

Their are not many books covering the Jagdtiger and it looks as if you have the most important ones.

If you are going to build a version with the MG42 on the engine deck then this would be a late version with factory applied camouflage the Hinterhalt pattern would not apply at this point in the war it most likely would also be void of tools including the jack, wartime pictures would conform this.

Welcome Don, hope you both enjoy your new project. Be warned, these models are addictive.

You have a resource here on the Forum in the Knowledge Base. The Topics listed as Basic will give you answers to a lot of the questions you may have, including guidance on painting. The Knowledge Base is intended to be a guide to best practice but you'll also find that there's no monopoly on wisdom and there are often several ways of doing things. Most of the questions you may have will almost certainly have featured in threads on the Forum. The search facility is one of your best friends.

Good luck.

Stephen

Welcome Don, and what a lot of questions

I can't answer most of them, but Mike Stannard developed a range of Zimmerit scribing tools, which are now sold by Field of Armor. FoA went through a sticky patch last year but hopefully are getting back on track. Unfortunately, their postage costs are prohibitive to the UK, but being in PA they should be OK for you.

There aren't that many custom suppliers for 1/6th scale armour, but they do seem to compliment each other in their ranges, so find out what they do and see if you think it will add to your model.

Regarding the size of the Zimm, whilst there can be a lot of enjoyment in researching things like this, there's also a lot to be said for the "if it looks right to me, it is right". There are people who get a lot of pleasure from making these kits millimetre perfect, and others who bung it together out of the box. The best advice I can give is to put the time into the part you enjoy the most, whether that is research, construction or super-detailing.

For painting, some people use rattle cans, some use spray guns, some use airbrushes, some use real brushes. It all depends on your familiarity with each. Getting the etch-priming and base colour is easy enough with cans or a spray gun, but I would imagine it's tricky to do the tri-colour camo with them. I bought an airbrush ages ago and really need to knuckle down and learn to use it

Adrian.

Welcome to the forum. I’m wrapping up my first build. It will be two years in May. One thing that set me way back was painting parts before assembly. It’s too much work and makes parts harder to fit. I’ll build my Jagdtiger completely before I paint it. Then I’ll remove the wheels and tracks and paint them all separately. Hope that helps!

Brian

Welcome aboard!

From not too far north and east of you in Vermont.

There are more and more of us 'Colonial" builders... which is good for Armortek and the hobby!

Look forward to your build and there are lots of awesome people, techniques, resources and (yes) encouragement here! I daresay the most challenging thing is keeping up with some of the real 'superbuilders' who can show some detailing and fabricating skills that make the rest of us pale in comparison.

But it's not a competition! So have a blast with your first kit! One of these days, there will have to be an Armortek USA meet-up!

Cheers,

RPR

P.S. As for painting... what has worked for me is to use a thin self-etch primer (I use black or grey SEM automotive grade rattlecan self-etching primer) between any components so that rust can't form in the unprotected spaces between components. Especially unlike metals like aluminum and steel. Then paint major assemblies in final colors. Then move on to final painting on the complete model. The big thing is to make sure you don't leave unprotected steel, even with another component on top of it.

Also, isn't East Coast Armory out of business or under Hiatus? Oddball's work is remarkable. But I thought he was not producing. I hope I am wrong!! And check out the For Sale section here as lots of neat items come up in the PX and Craftsmans Market.

mark lawson wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:32 pm

If you are going to build a version with the MG42 on the engine deck then this would be a late version with factory applied camouflage the Hinterhalt pattern would not apply at this point in the war it most likely would also be void of tools including the jack, wartime pictures would conform this.

Interesting. I was under the impression that the reason most of the JadgTigers aren't seen with a complement of tools was due to them being disabled by their German crews with charges inside the gun and cabin that caused the tools to "blow off" due to the explosions.

Adrian Harris wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 31, 2020 10:50 pm

a range of Zimmerit scribing tools, which are now sold by Field of Armor. FoA went through a sticky patch last year but hopefully are getting back on track. Unfortunately, their postage costs are prohibitive to the UK, but being in PA they should be OK for you.

...

"if it looks right to me, it is right".

Thanks Adrian! Both great guidance. I will check into FoA.

Brian Ostlind wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 01, 2020 12:06 am

Welcome to the forum. I’m wrapping up my first build. It will be two years in May. One thing that set me way back was painting parts before assembly. It’s too much work and makes parts harder to fit. I’ll build my Jagdtiger completely before I paint it. Then I’ll remove the wheels and tracks and paint them all separately. Hope that helps!

Brian

That does help. Thank you for the advice.

Robert Reid wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 01, 2020 12:48 am

So have a blast with your first kit! One of these days, there will have to be an Armortek USA meet-up!

...

P.S. As for painting... what has worked for me is to use a thin self-etch primer (I use black or grey SEM automotive grade rattlecan self-etching primer) between any components so that rust can't form in the unprotected spaces between components. Especially unlike metals like aluminum and steel. Then paint major assemblies in final colors. Then move on to final painting on the complete model. The big thing is to make sure you don't leave unprotected steel, even with another component on top of it.

Also, isn't East Coast Armory out of business or under Hiatus? Oddball's work is remarkable. But I thought he was not producing. I hope I am wrong!! And check out the For Sale section here as lots of neat items come up in the PX and Craftsmans Market.

A meetup would be great!

Thanks for the painting advice. Especially the corrosion protection.

I was thinking for the Aluminum we would use a cleaner followed by a protectant prior to paint.

An aircraft grade zinc phosphate primer was going to be my choice.

East Coast Armory seems to be updating facebook regularly and the website less regularly. He's in PA so I hope to meetup with him at some point.

[/quote]

Interesting. I was under the impression that the reason most of the JadgTigers aren't seen with a complement of tools was due to them being disabled by their German crews with charges inside the gun and cabin that caused the tools to "blow off" due to the explosions.
[/quote]

Towards the end of the war German Panzer were being sent out minus tools as the rate of retreat was so fast that even if Panzer broke a track the likely hood was it would be over run before it could be repaired it also saved time not having to attach these parts. This would apply to all late Panzer and Panzerjäger

mark lawson wrote: ↑

Sat Feb 01, 2020 8:20 am

[quote="Don Gray"
Interesting. I was under the impression that the reason most of the JadgTigers aren't seen with a complement of tools was due to them being disabled by their German crews with charges inside the gun and cabin that caused the tools to "blow off" due to the explosions.

Towards the end of the war German Panzer were being sent out minus tools as the rate of retreat was so fast that even if Panzer broke a track the likely hood was it would be over run before it could be repaired it also saved time not having to attach these parts. This would apply to all late Panzer and Panzerjäger
[/quote]

Thank you. Very interesting. Do you have a date around when this started happening?

I didn’t know this little tidbit either. Interested to hear Marks response. Mark makes some upgrade parts I have ordered for my Tigers. I am always looking out for upgrade parts on the forum from a variety of suppliers. Even though historical accuracy is important...I like to design my model primarily with my imagination with historical reference as more of a suggestion than law.

Don, it would depend on the factory some would have emitted tools later than others but you would be looking at late 44 to early 45, it was October when jacks were no longer fitted to Tiger II this would be the same with Jagdtiger.

Brian Ostlind wrote: ↑

Sun Feb 02, 2020 4:08 am

Even though historical accuracy is important...I like to design my model primarily with my imagination with historical reference as more of a suggestion than law.

I hear Heresy - Burn the Warlock !